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Old Jun 05, 2007, 08:32 AM // 08:32   #21
Jungle Guide
 
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No my Feral uses fist weapons like wind and fire wheels or (the punsh blade thing, I never remember the name)

The most chakram like weapon they might use is the full-moon blade, though I'm not sure about using that one because that is both a melee and ranged weapon, which would not go well with their other weapons.

Nice picture I should photoshop the metal armor to look chitin'y, then it would be really fitting for their look.
Though I probably wont have any time for the next 3 weeks.
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Old Jun 05, 2007, 04:28 PM // 16:28   #22
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Looking good there, buddy! The pet really makes this class... Go go SC little brother. Thanks for the nod of the hat, this CC is really interesting and I couldn't help but chime in with some ideas. I'm glad they helped out.

I'm just reading through the CC again. The attributes are great now... simple descriptions, but covering enough ground. I also really, really like the ranged weapons (especially the spray... now that is an effective way to condition spam)! The Chimera seems to incorporated nicely.

Just a few suggestions for an easier reading experience:

1) You may want to update the original introduction since it's now out-of-date.

2) The skill descriptions are pretty long and bothersome to read. I'm not sure, maybe include augmentation base damage in the general description, but not the description of each skill (i.e. every dagger-type augmentation deals the same base damage, no?). Maybe 'touch your chimera...' isn't needed in front of every augmentation skill since it applies to all augmentations and is a given.

3) I don't get Devouring Mound.

4) Tighten up the whole Weapon and New Skills section if you can... it's a real pain to read.

Other than that, I really like the class! I think it's cohesive and a cool identity. Two problems I spot. First problem: is this class's function still about condition spamming? Because it doesn't really seem to be focused on that aspect anymore. Perfection is token self-support, Mutation is mostly ranged attack-related skills (and some seemingly random add-ons), Mutilation is Melee enhancement, and Abomination is pet-buffing. Now the Fleshcrafter just seems like a versatile and effective ranged/melee attacker with a really powerful pet at his side.

Second problem: I don't mean to be annoying, but I'm gonna tell you what I think: it seems to me that the melee weapon augmentations don't really fit with this CC anymore. Firstly, if this CC is supposed to be a condition spammer, hitting one enemy at a time up close is not the best way to go about doing that. The three ranged weapons you put up are a lot more effective in that respect. Secondly, and maybe more importantly, isn't the CC supposed to be fairly weak? It seems like he should be if there is this nearly invincible golem supporting him (and I think the golem is a great idea). But think about it: why would a weak spellcaster have whole attribute devoted to skills which force him to get right in the fray of things?

Would it make more sense to have a self-help attribute, a golem attribute, an augmentation attribute, and then a condition spamming attribute? Augmentations would be ranged (spray, handlauncher, and chakram) with a few non-offensive melee augmentations maybe (the bone shield, bloated body, and limber, for instance). This redefines the CC as ranged/mid-ranged, but it's still pretty versatile with the three variations of pins. And it just makes more sense to me. A weak, ranged condition spammer sends in his hulking chimera as a distraction while he sits and back and spams conditions on the opposing team.

Maybe it's a bad idea... I'm just writing it as it comes. You could probably come up with a better way to fix this problem. But do you see the dilemma? The fleshcrafter seems like someone who wouldn't head into the fray. And if he has enough health to do that, I don't see what his major weakness is.
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Old Jun 09, 2007, 05:26 PM // 17:26   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nebojats
Go go SC little brother.
O.o I don't have any older siblings, I'm not used to being a little anything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nebojats
1) You may want to update the original introduction since it's now out-of-date.
I changed several of the descriptions, Thought the becomming more than human into still applies I think
Quote:
Originally Posted by nebojats
2) The skill descriptions are pretty long and bothersome to read... ... Maybe 'touch your chimera...' isn't needed in front of every augmentation skill since it applies to all augmentations and is a given.
You are right about that, changed it abit so that none of the augmentations now have adescription longer than 3 lines.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nebojats
I'm not sure, maybe include augmentation base damage in the general description, but not the description of each skill (i.e. every dagger-type augmentation deals the same base damage, no?).
Not really, they type only specifies the attack speed and the types of attacks you can use with it.
I was actually thinking of using 1-handed hammers as well as 2 handed hammers, which deal lower damage because of the 1-handed benefit.
Also a attribute= 9 augmentation has a requirement of 9 to use, a req: 9 dagger already deals max damage, wouldn't a req:16 augmentation deal over the top damage then?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nebojats
3) I don't get Devouring Mound.
Devouring Mound elite chimera energy 25 activation 4 recharge 60
If you don't have a chimera you lose 40...110(140) health and create a Devouring Mound that much max health.
Each second a Devouring Mound is near an creature suffering from deep wound it gains 10 additional Max health, this can not increase it's health past 300.
If you have a chimera you suffer from deep wound for 13 seconds and your chimera is healed for 10...17(19)% of your max health.

Yes there is indeed something wrong with the description, I think it is the only one left I could not fige out how to describe in less than 4 lines.

But it is a chimera with a built in harvester(a mouth) which is why it is an elite.
The harvesting growths add apendages or tools to the chimera with wich it can look for materials and build it'self up.
The devouring mound devours the severed body parts or hanging out guts of a creature suffering from deepwound, by this it grows bigger and has more health.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nebojats
4) Tighten up the whole Weapon and New Skills section if you can... it's a real pain to read.
Removed (hopefully all) the redundant descriptions form the new stuff section.

As for ranged/melee, some conditions are more logically caused by melee than ranged.
I count knock down as a condition, it would be one of the favorites and is only available through mutilation.
Bleeding and deep wound are mutilation only, while disease is mutation only.
Weakness is in both attributes because I like it as a defensive measure.

I think causing all those conditions from 1 attribute, and all at a relatively safe range would be terribly overpowered.
While both attributes, are meant to increase you combat efficiency and both have their limitations.
To gain the perfect combination of conditions (-20% health + 12 degeneration) you are forced to switch augmentations. And do so a lot as well as I intentionally kept the durations from augmentation that passively apply conditions short.

Last edited by System_Crush; Feb 05, 2008 at 10:36 AM // 10:36..
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Old Jun 14, 2007, 09:30 AM // 09:30   #24
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Amazing love the idea, love the way you described love everything about it well done. I would love to see this sometime in the game it owuld be great fun to play.
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Old Jun 22, 2007, 11:04 PM // 23:04   #25
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Have you heard of the Fleshreaver^^?

Quote:
Fleshreavers
Fleshreavers are horrible, fleshy monsters with an unusual method of evolution. A young fleshreaver is born as barely more than a small skeleton; the parents assure the survival of their young by layering muscle, tissue, and flesh over the delicate newborn.

Sewn together by older fleshreavers, they use only the finest musculature and bone from prey to flesh out the body and wings of their young, carving horns from the discarded bone fragments. Once a fledging fleshreaver has been fully created, it must continue the handiwork of its parents, acquiring new flesh pieces and better musculature to attach to its skeletal structure in order to supplant its rapidly growing form.

http://www.gamingnexus.com/Default.a...ullNews&I=4811

Last edited by [M]agna_[C]arta; Jun 22, 2007 at 11:37 PM // 23:37..
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Old Jun 23, 2007, 08:19 AM // 08:19   #26
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No, I hadn't heard of those at all.
I I got my idea more form chimera makers and the D&D fleshgolems, that have to be built piece by piece, each piece inscribed with healing runes to keep the flesh from decaying.

But thanks for telling me about fleshweavers, now I have an excuse to say Anet has implemented my ideas
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Old Jun 24, 2007, 05:29 PM // 17:29   #27
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I read the latest edition.
Must say, a Wonderful CC indeed, great work, System Crush, like always.

Must say the name of Fleshcrafter sound very cool. Althought does not sound like an usual proffession's name, and feel more like a Perstige Class of sort.

At first read, it does sound alot like a Warrior/Necro combo... but than I notice the gem of this CC, the synergy between player and their Chimera. This made the feel of play lot more unique than anything else. Kudo.

Also the skills and the name are great too. Big Kudo.

But one thing I did not get very clear, is how does Chimera Harvest?
Do they feed on the dead? Would that expolit the corpues? How much health they gain per feeding? Etc.

What I might suggest would be...
  • A differnt between base hp and add hp (nick name "fat" here) A Chimera would be created with 100 base hp. What it gain later will be the added hp, fat. the Fat is not the max hp, thus can not be heal or regin to that full amount. When take damage, or used in crafting, it would be the Fat that goes out first, befoe tapping into the base hp. There would be certain skills that allow change some of the Fat to increase the base hp of the Chimera.
  • (this is somewhat to avoid healing up of Chimera, and to better place their role as a storage battery)

  • Chimera will feed on the feed on the dead automatically. It Suck the dead... gaining about 10 hp/fat per second, and up to a max amount. The max amount is determain by the dead's level (so a lv 20 would offer about 70hp to convert to fat, thus 7 second of feeding to get it all) and the level of Chimera (determin by the attribute, so a 15point Chimera can carry max of 350 hp, while a 1 point Chimera only about 100hp). More so, with cetain skills, you could command the Chimera to feed on a living foe.
  • Chimera should also be use in offensive if player choose. This allow more variation of roles and build. This could be done by allowing you to Fleshcraft them, adding Mutation skill onto them. Thus you could give them some claws or tails, which would make the more agguressive. However, that also would mean they won't be feeding as much, and taking more damages, making them less useful tod dual purpose as a battery.
  • Wings, could be added as part of the Flesh mutation as well. Afterall, everyone like wings....
  • I think one thing that might limited this class is the too much dependency upon the Chimera for many of the skills. Should also allow to use those skills, even with out Chimera. To do so, you would take your own hp (but the cost would be double that of Chimera), and suffer a 10% deepwound for few seconds.


oh, and a bit of trival note... If I remember right, Warhammer Online supposely have a class on the Chaos' side that can mutate their body into weapon too. Here is a concept character pic from them... which would seem very fitting to this CC.



http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/...007CArt_05.jpg
(from Warhammer Online)

Last edited by actionjack; Jun 24, 2007 at 05:35 PM // 17:35..
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Old Jun 25, 2007, 10:03 AM // 10:03   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AJ
But one thing I did not get very clear, is how does Chimera Harvest?
Do they feed on the dead? Would that expolit the corpues? How much health they gain per feeding? Etc.
Well a Chimera is basically just an ugly thing wandering around, looking ugly and monstrous.

With the exception of 1 or 2 elite chimera skills, no chimera can harvest all by themselves.
You need to give them a Harvesting growth(lowering the health they where created with)
They then gain the ability to harvest, completely dependent on which harvesting growth they got, this harvesting growth states how much materials(fat, additional max health) the chimera gets for each second it manages to fulfill the conditional.
If a harvest growth where to exploit corpses this would be stated in it's skill description.

Adding a harvest growth to a blank chimera, means the chimera is created with health that is directly usable for skills, I did not really differate between damage to materials and to the chimera's health.

Instead I gave all the harvesting abilities a max amount of health they can increase the chimera's (base)health too, these should always keep their health lower than 480 which is the player max.
I made 1 elite with witch chimera's can gain more than this set amount, in which case lost health can no longer be healed back

Which could be unbalancing as chimera's are semi-permanent.
I'll change it to.

As long as a chimera stays at or below the max amount of health allowed by the harvest growth it currently has then it can be healed back normally(and even if it is at it's max it can still harvest to heal it's self but it won't increase it's max health anymore)
When a chimera doesn't have a harvest growth damage it takes does lower its max health, up to the amount it had when it was created.

This should make it more important to keep a harvesting growth on your chimera. In addition to that I'll change that chimera's can't regenerate health while not in combat.(no red engines for chimmys)
All damage to your chimera will have to be healed by growths or healing you cast on it.

To all of this still applies that using a skill that consumes chimera health lowers the chimera's current max health, which can only be raised again by harvest growths.

(description updated)

Chimeras are made out of the player's health, as prepared materials, hence fc's can already use their own health as material, though I did worry about making a chimera and then using it up would be too much of a hassle; you pretty much confirmed that is it is, so I changed the description.

I'm not sure about chimera's attacking, I know it would be nice but I didn't build the fleshcrafter towards a pet supporter, their pet supports them, in which case if the have a supportive pet that attacks and is semi-permanent that is pretty much the same as a ranger pet.

Wing's are cool, perhaps I could put them back in, they would be good for the strengthening of the fleshcrafter's relation to Dwayna. It's just I already had a lot of skills, didn't want to overload everybody again(though I still probably did)

Warhammer was one of the upcoming MMO's that interested me very little, but in light of that I might have to go and check it out, thnx for telling me AJ.

Last edited by System_Crush; Jun 25, 2007 at 11:13 AM // 11:13..
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Old Jun 25, 2007, 01:02 PM // 13:02   #29
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Why! Why do none of my own threads enjoy this much popularity? Why do I like this class so much better then half of the ones I thought about. And why on earth did you have to make a class that continuously sets my eyes on fire? *aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah my eyeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees*
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Old Jun 26, 2007, 09:48 AM // 09:48   #30
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Yay, I miss your posting Action Jack^^!
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Old Jul 05, 2007, 06:48 AM // 06:48   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Defiled Knight
Amazing love the idea, love the way you described love everything about it well done. I would love to see this sometime in the game it owuld be great fun to play.
I love that you love it.
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